What a fantasy land you are living in.

Even if you were right about the legal system keeping up (you’re not), it is failing so hard is other ways, it doesn’t even matter. Do you remember Citizens United where the Supreme Court allowed endless and unchecked amounts of money to flood our political system accelerating us down this path of division? How about SC giving our president complete immunity to do whatever he wants in office? Or the Trump appointed judge that intentionally derailed his prosecutions so no one could hold him accountable? Or how about the SC justice that retired early so his son could get a cushy job in return for Trump being able to appoint another justice? That legal system? Yea, it’s functioning great. A real bulwark there.

Secondly, you really believe that was this one series of peaceful protests the ONLY and driving factor behind Indian independence? Not the fact that the British had a failing empire and needed funds to rebuild after WWII? How about the fact that they had their hands full in the middle east and China at the same time? Or that they no longer had the forces, resources or will to contunue to fight the armed resistance in the country? Chalking up a remarkably complex series of events and outcomes to a single factor shows how little you understand about the world.

No one is asking anyone to bleed for anyone. I just don’t have blinders on and can see what is coming. I also have a deep enough understanding of history to understand how freedom is obtained and maintained. Sorry that offends you, but it really seems like a personal problem. Have fun with that.

Comical edit. Can’t actually respond with substance, so you try to misstate the position you cannot rebut and undermine it will a silly ad hominem attack because I haven’t used a forum for as long as you. Classic.

Let’s be clear - I wish the world didn’t work the way it does, but you can’t argue with millenia of human history. Even your own examples of idealisn were so paper thin, they couldn’t stand 5 minutes of scrutiny. I would honestly love to live in a world where reason and intellect were sufficient to win the day. Unfortunately, whenever we start down that path, it always seems to get blown up by bad actors that would rather see the world burn than lose power. Burying your head in the sand about reality doesn’t help anyone.

Bad actors are in charge. They have no respect to our current system or the people in it, and they are actively trying to destroy it for their own personal gain. We can either let them, or we can do something about. If seeing and understanding the magnitude of our current situation makes me a “larper”, so be it. I’d rather be that than whatever you are, or are pretending to be.

Good luck to you out there. Sounds like you are going to need it.

Zero. Your point?

You avoided the primary question - what’s the line them? It honestly doesn’t even really matter, since the whole premise of your post is that there is a line and that you eventually have to strike and use force. Our only disagreement is where that line actually is.

Besides, acting like Portland was some grand victory is just silly. OK - the national guard is out of Portland for the moment. They just moved on to their next target. They flood the zone and move fast so the legal system can’t keep up. The damage was already done and they just moved to sow chaos in a new location with a different militarized force. What a win.

Peaceful protests are an important tool to the fight, but these people only fear consequences. Physical, emotional, reputational or financial harm. It’s a multi-faceted fight, but that’s what it is - a fight. If they think they can best you through physical force alone, that’s what they will do. You can’t let them think that. You need a stick to respond in kind with.

Maybe you should read up on the Hindustan Socialist Republican Association or the Indian National Army. They both played major roles in Indian independence. Ghandi is a great story, but guess who he had as a counter balance? The stick.

So what’s the line in your mind? When do we fight? They are actively destroying families and people’s lives across this country every minute because they don’t think laws or standards of basic morality apply to them. They are literally murdering American citizens who dare to stand in their way.

The president and his party are funding a private army that has a bigger budget than most nations. Guess what they are doing with it? Buying guns and surveillance equipment. Can you guess why?

Look across the world. Look at history. Americans need to stop believing that we are something special and that fascism can’t happen to us. It can. It is. Wake up.

They’re bullies. There is only one way to stop a bully, and it’s not by sitting on the sidelines and hoping they stop on their own.

With all do respect, you sound incredibly naive. We aren’t entitled to the freedoms we have enjoyed for most of our respective lives. If anything, this post-WWII period is an anamoly of human history. Freedom and autonomy come at a cost and, unfortunately, sometimes that cost is blood.